curious...how did you end up on this?

Another thought - What role, if any, should a minister/pastor/clergyman have with regard to speaking out publicly beyond his/her four walls. Does that change when he/she starts to address politics? If so, is there a danger that people will start to attend a church that is more in line with their political views vs. attending a church the feeds them spiritually?

I have a friend who is a pastor of a small church in TN., and feels the government should be doing more to help the homeless and underserved. Is that what we want – mandating that we help through our government instead of doing with conviction what Christ instructed me to do? I cannot help but wonder why the church is not stepping up in a bigger way. I know that Westside is, but there are a lot that are not. Then again there are a lot that are doing even more than we are. There are so many good examples out there why isn’t more being done? Is the problem so huge that it feels like we are bucking against a tidal wave?

I guess I am asking a lot of things without really having an answer, but to start it all off, what is the voice that should be shared? ...Sorry for the dump....

Great job this weekend. Love your energy!

Not alot to add to this exchange of thoughts. I totally agree with everything.

So here is a question related to this. What if the way I relax is to work in the garden, etc. Is this work? Even if it means I am relaxing? What about riding a bike for 4 hours? Does it change if I am praying or thinking of God? What if I only think about God off and on?

Dang... this didn't load the boxes before!

Okay… so that is an interesting question/statement. I would love to hear what you have to say about “responsibility.” But since you asked, I will start - the dictionary says this that responsibility is a duty or obligation to satisfactorily perform or complete a task (assigned by someone, or created by one's own promise or circumstances) that one must fulfill, and which has a consequent penalty for failure.

To me it means if I take responsibility for something I “own” it. I cannot blame anyone else because - it is up to me to do or to finish. Also, the word responsibility has been used a ton over the years. With that in mind, and since I love to collect interesting quotes, following are some quotes to ponder:

Life is a gift, and it offers us the privilege, opportunity, and responsibility to give something back by becoming more. - Tony Robbins

If you take responsibility for yourself you will develop a hunger to accomplish your dreams. - Les Brown

I will offer up one of my own: God has given us a gift. Whatever that gift may be, it is our responsibility to use it in a way that glorifies Him. - Michael

I am still struggling with the following “Heresy” regarding tithing supported by Biblical backing:
"You can give to any cause you want and call it your tithe."

Personally, traditionally I looked at my tithing from the Big C church standpoint and not the little C church standpoint. If I am financially helping with a mission trip, a soup kitchen, the guy on the street, who ever and what ever it might be as long as it is furthering the kingdom of God – isn’t that part of the Big C church? Isn't that what God would call being part of the Big C church - looking out for each other - helping each other - doing it without thought? Does it really need to be these things, plus give an additional 10% (or the first 10% and then these however you want to look at it) to the little c church?

Interesting.

Interesting to hear that Mark Driskoll feels it is about Church planting and not necessarily Multi-site teaching. That he believes that when he dies, each of the multi-sites would become independent. Not sure I believe that. Use our church as an example – fallen leader, 3-4 years later, it is still the multi-site format.

Another interesting point – multi-site churches teach young men to preach via the smaller multi-site location, and more experienced guys jumping in via the larger site. Kinda like to hear that and see it in action.

When I said, "In my very humble opinion, Jesus would say if it saves one life then do it. Sometimes I would imagine the fear of making someone mad might cause administration to say, ‘but we might lose a few.” That was not an attempt to jab at the church. It is just merely a question that I do not know the answer to.

I am constantly looking for answers to all aspects of church life that come to mind. Sometimes those questions, when read (or reread by me), can be misunderstood.

Definitely not attempting to criticize, just asking questions.

Fun conversation... "should it be a question of who can this reach as opposed to who does this offend?" - Bold question! I wonder what would happen if that was asked of Jesus – how do you think He would answer that question? Follow up point - how do you think the "administration" of a church would answer that same question? I am no theologian. With that said, and being just an ordinary guy that loves Jesus, I think I can guess how Jesus might answer that question. I am not so sure about administration though.

In my very humble opinion, Jesus would say if it saves one life then do it. Sometimes I would imagine the fear of making someone mad might cause administration to say, “but we might lose a few.”

So what is the next question? In my mind it still comes back to what do you want to accomplish by engaging this group? If you were asking me, I might say something like – why me? What do you need me for? Where is this going? Why have you identified “artist” as a particular group of people to approach? Are there answers to these questions? Is it just because you are an artist and you care for other liked minded people? If so, make it know! What better way to talk to a group of people than to be connected to them in some small way anyway.

So, in conclusion I say it is always better to work from the knowledge of what you expect to achieve and then back away from it until you find the start. If you don’t know where you want to end up, you will never know where to start.

For example, it is like going to a movie theatre with a bunch of friends, and not knowing what you want to see. Then, after discussing it for a little while, buying your tickets in different ways (cash, credit cards, online, etc.). Then you head to the concession stand and trying to figure out if it makes sense to buy the combo pack, or just get a small popcorn and soda – should I share with so and so, or just get something for myself. Then you head off to the theater and realizing that each of you wants to sit somewhere different, but you want to be together.

I am not saying you will know everything along the way. That is not possible, but at least you will know what movie you want to see and that you want to sit together. Everything in between is the fun part. Then, once you know why you want to engage them, then you can talk about the next questions you listed above. “What art do we need to reach so & so? What speaks to this community?”

Again, just an ordinary guy, throwing out one humble opinion in a sea of opinions. I am sooo far from being an expert it is silly.