en-us http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html Comments from Parents bringing kids for punishment shooting \'by appointment\' - BelfastTelegraph.co.uk http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753921384Hey rant1234 nice nattering to you. Started reading Catch 22 decades ago. After 5 pages I put it down. I couldn't get into it at all. Or I couldn't be bothered making any more effort. Cather in the Rye was something the same. Maybe it was just me. Thu, 21 Nov 2013 14:37:41 +0000http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753921384 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753908541Again, TJ, as I said earlier, Catch 22. In case you're not an old git like me and haven't heard that phrase, dead if you do and dead if you don't; unfortunately for too many in NI, literally the truth. Here's to better days. Thu, 21 Nov 2013 14:09:36 +0000http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753908541 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753826227Some of these 'children' are selling drugs outside our schools..... Thu, 21 Nov 2013 11:09:48 +0000http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753826227 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753816490Hey rant1234 I hear what you are rightly saying about the normal constraints in any civilized society that are placed upon the police and the courts. Perhaps we need to recognise that, these are not is normal communities and therefore need to be dealt with in a not normal way? Unless something radical is suggested then the problems will simply continue with the police and the law being largely ineffective and punishment beatings/shootings continuing apace. As this story goes away it will all be realitive quietness in the press for the next few months and then there will be another nasty shooting/beating and we will all throw our hands up in horror once again. -until the next time. Thu, 21 Nov 2013 10:48:23 +0000http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753816490 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753804681Again, TJ, I agree, but the police can only provide a viable threat to criminals when they have support from the community and when they are able to obtain evidence that leads to conviction. It is almost impossible to provide positive policing when witnesses will not give evidence, whatever the reason, and that is where the thug holds the advantage; intimidation, assault etc. The judiciary and the prison service are hamstrung by the bleeding heart liberals in our society who believe that, whoever may to be to blame, it is never the actual criminal committing the offence; he/she has always been disadvantaged in some way. Thu, 21 Nov 2013 10:21:12 +0000http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753804681 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753462046Surely rant1234 it is up to the police/courts to be pro active enough and 'strong' enough to begin with to pose a viable threat to those who would break the law, - obviously they are not. So for the well being of the majority lawabiders, we need a police force that is feared by the baddies and a judiciary that is powerful enough to put the baddies away for a long time and we need a prison service that provides a real deterrent and not an 'xbox type life style' a place that prisoners never want to come back to. Wed, 20 Nov 2013 19:40:42 +0000http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753462046 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753321364Kneecapping for this activity is definitely non=republican and anti-social. Wed, 20 Nov 2013 14:21:06 +0000http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753321364 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753314316You are talking about a police force that existed more than 40 years ago and even then, even with the corrupt individuals, it was not as bad as it suited the terrorists groups to make them. That is how they got control of their communities in the first place and they will certainly not be giving up that control without a fight. Those communities are isolated and disenfranchised, living as they do under the threat of the mob. However, sad though it may be to say so, they have to be masters of their own destiny, at least in the early stages of any moves to get these scum out of their lives. Wed, 20 Nov 2013 14:05:54 +0000http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753314316 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753311919Absolutely TJ and that is what I said in my last sentence. The problem is, there really is no other solution - Catch 22. Wed, 20 Nov 2013 14:00:51 +0000http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753311919 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753241112Absolutely. Wed, 20 Nov 2013 11:24:48 +0000http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment753241112 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment752919041anyhow it,s only 5% of the the population who are involved in this crap. self inflicted i say . get on with your life ? and let the 95%get on with theirs............ Tue, 19 Nov 2013 21:19:31 +0000http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment752919041 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment752892724'but unfortunately until local communities either throw these animals out of their society or combine together to report them to the authorities,' I hear what you are saying rant1234 and I'm not trying to be nasty but would you dare to do this when the consequences could be terrifying for you and your family members? How would you like to go out in the morning to find you new car 'keyed' and without tyres? -And this would only be the beginning. It would take a very brave man/woman to do as you say. Would the police be able to protect you and yours in your community? I don't think so. Tue, 19 Nov 2013 20:12:22 +0000http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment752892724 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment752837407The Police have been complicit and enabling in the matter of "punishment attacks." They have used and abused the youth of our communities, recruiting them as informers because of their vulnerability and mental health issues. This leads to further isolation within their own communities and they become further alienated from any similarities of normality. There must be law, and the community has been left with an enormous conundrum. It has never been solved. Tue, 19 Nov 2013 17:56:21 +0000http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment752837407 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment752834451Absolutely right...to be very crude...garbage in garbage out...if all these kids know from the time they are toddlers aware of their environment is emotional and physical neglect and there are no positive role models to nurture and guide them then what in the world can one expect? But worse those kids then have kids of their own and round the circle of dysfunction goes once again. Violence is common place. Its the way to settle arguments and keep the 'peace, establish and maintain law and order in a lawless community. What a shambles. Tue, 19 Nov 2013 17:48:48 +0000http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment752834451 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment752824699Couldn't agree more, but unfortunately until local communities either throw these animals out of their society or combine together to report them to the authorities, this will go on in our worst estates and areas. The police are powerless when there is no evidence and no one prepared to make a stand. I don't necessarily blame them because it is a terrifying ordeal to have to go through, but there is no other answer - we have to get rid of this pond life. Tue, 19 Nov 2013 17:24:36 +0000http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment752824699 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment752819661If the police are largely impotent therefore seen as irrelevant by many living in certain areas and the courts issue only weak limited fines, suspended sentences or short jail sentences, then frustrated angry residents will always be tempted to look to the paramilitaries, to sort out problems like vandalism, stealing, drug abuse, anti-social behaviour etc. This is the inevitable outcome of a total break down in the application of law and order in these areas. I am merely stating the obvious. Tue, 19 Nov 2013 17:12:15 +0000http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment752819661 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment752803642How dare any ignoramus put a gun to one of these children. ...............Yep, couldn't agree with your comments more. Then the cowards must know how to pick their victims so as they know whose parents will not come tooled up to eliminate the judge and jury. Yes drug dealing is a scourge on our society but so is shooting to handicapp our young people for the rest of their life.. Tue, 19 Nov 2013 16:33:46 +0000http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment752803642 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment752793954You can wrap it up in whatever language you want - these actions are barbaric and have no place in a civilised society. Tue, 19 Nov 2013 16:10:29 +0000http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment752793954 http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment752753896I've always detested the brutal act of shooting people in the knees. I would die first before handing my child over to people who use Irish Republicanism as a guise to bolster their own personal feelings of self admiration. It's not a true Irish Republican doctrine to hurt teenagers, to maim them forever and to stand in their way of fulfilling their lives. In fact it's the opposite, Irish Republicanism is meant to enthuse and bolster the very best that our youth has to offer regardless of social class or political persuasions or family status. Criminality does happen, especially with youth living in poverty, but with age most kids will mature and turn away from crime when they want to settle down. We must allow flexibility for the tougher years of adolescence. Drugs are a scourge on all of our communities and the families and individuals effected by them deserve our help and support. But the vast majority of these kids are selling dope to friends to feed their own habits. They are addicts, not criminal masterminds making a fortune. Many of them are victims, although it's sometimes very difficult to see past their activities. But they have been mired and compromised by a failed society that doesn't know how to deal with its own past, including the thousands who were "kneecapped" or crucified in repulsive so called punishment beatings. They are leaving school undereducated, and underloved, feeling valueless. Much of our youth live in direct dysfunction, with mothers and fathers enmeshed in alcoholism and popping pills. They don't partake in anything worthwhile because they have never seen anything worthwhile. How dare any ignoramus put a gun to one of these children. Tue, 19 Nov 2013 14:28:34 +0000http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/news/local-national/northern-ireland/parents-bringing-kids-for-punishment-shooting-by-appointment-29764749.html#IDComment752753896